| Search for walks and images: |
Outdoors in Crete - Discussion
Outdoor Holidays in CreteWalking and Cycling in Crete - the book
Please check if a topic already exists before starting a new topic. New Topic
All Messages by Topic:
New messages.htm
Visit Peter's Crete and Greek Islands Store for Books and Equipment
| E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
Hi ! My name is Bernard Laverton, and I live in Norway. On the 26th of september I planned to walk from Sougia to Agia Roumeli. I had started on the 21st of september at Kastelli Kissamos and followed the E4 all the way by foot to Sougia. I left Sougia at 07:30 and arrived at the sea at the end of the Tripiti gorge by about 12:30. I continued eastwards over the rocks, and then past 2 buildings where a shepherd lived. About an hour or so later the path started going down to the sea, and the word END! was painted in yellow on a rock. But there were more E4 signposts, and I continued. It got more difficult, I managed to get through a hole in the cliffs near the sea, but then I had the choice of going up a narrow "gorge" or going along the sea edge. The gorge option was completely blocked by a large rock,and the sea option looked impossible. I chose to return to Sougia, a 5-6 hour walk back. On the beach before Tripiti I spoke to the shepherd. He said he walks to Agia Roumeli, and could not understand that I found the path blocked. Does anyone have some information about this? Is the path blocked or is it passable? If the path is blocked, shouldn't some information be put up somewhere? This would help prevent people having to do a 12 hour walk without getting to the destination. Any help would be appreciated. I got this reply from the West Crete information centre; "I haven't walked the path in a long time so have no current information on it. I personally think that people should not walk on it anyway because it is in bad condition, dangerous at times and easy to get lost. This is one of the reasons why I have no intention whatsoever of publishing any information about it because it only encourages people to walk it and sometimes get into trouble." On www.cretetravel.com it says in fact that this path has recently been opened and is marked. Best regards, Bernard Laverton
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
Thanks for that information. It is as detailed on the problems of the route as I have seen, and agrees with other comments on this part of the route. I had hoped that the designation of the E4 would result in some money being spent on creating a walking path through this region. Clearly this is not the case. Peter
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
I am curious to know who set up the E4 - when and who did it, and not least who financed it. Was it a once only affair and has since only deteriorated ? Or is there any maintenance now ? And does the E4 exist anywhere else in Greece ? Who is responsible for it, the authorities or a private organisation ? Any info or links you might have would be appreciated. Bernard
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
As far as I know the E4 is only scattered waymarking of existing paths. Often this waymarking is erratic. There is no maintenance of these paths. The path between Sougia and Agia Roumeli has always been difficult to find and dangerous to follow. No money has been spent on improving it. A greek speaking friend set out to walk this section. His account is rather wordy, but it illustrates well the dangers of this part of the walk. http://sjwalks.interkriti.org/0020040.htm Peter
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
br />
I am very gratefull for the link. I haven't seen these pages before. Concerning the E4, there MUST be some central authority somewhere behind it all ? In order to draw up the route in the first place, so that the sections join up. And to use the same type of sign. And someone to initiate the whole process. Bernard
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
I have added two maps that show the geography of this area. These maps have proved to be very reliable in other areas. The path is clearly shown in some sections, but is hidden by the detail of cliffs and gorges in other places. If anyone with personal experience of walking this stretch could add their route to a copy of the map and return it to me, that would be a great help to everyone. www.peter-thomson.co.uk/crete/maps/agia-roumeli.jpg 8 Dec 03 13:11 1.1Mb www.peter-thomson.co.uk/crete/maps/soujia.jpg 8 Dec 03 13:11 765Kb Peter
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
br />
Here is the section Sougia to Agia Roumeli taken from the latest Harms Verlag map of West Crete, on which the E4 is clearly marked in red. I have placed an arrow as accurately as I can at the point where I had to turn back:- http://home.c2i.net/laverton/crete/map2.jpg These photographs I took the day after my failed attempt to walk the section, from the ferry. The first picture shows the Tripiti gorge just to the right of centre, about 4 hours from Sougia. As you continue to the right (east) you come shortly to a beach, where a shepherd lives, and there are two small buildings. Continuing on for an hour or more, I came to the point where I had to turn back, shown by an arrow. There are E4 signs right up to this. At the arrow is a very narrow gorge. This is filled with trees, and further up it the gorge branches to the right. This then continues on to what looks like a cutting in the rocks, at a height of some 60 metre above the sea. Could this be the path. Whatever way the path takes, I cannot understand that the shepherd I met could have walked along here with his donkey. To the far right I guess we can see the Klados Gorge ending on a beach. http://home.c2i.net/laverton/crete/tripiti-gorge.jpg http://home.c2i.net/laverton/crete/west-of-tripiti.jpg Bernard
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
Useful pictures Bernard, but I don't think the picture extends as far as the Klados Gorge. There is a church visible on the high ground to the west of the Tripiti gorge which gives the scale of your picture. the path runs down the slope from the col behind the church to the mouth of the gorge, and then continues across the slope above the sea cliffs to the east. Stelios managed to complete the walk on his next attempt, so we will see if he can throw more light on this. Peter
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
The walk eastward from the Tripiti gorge continues right down on the rocks by the sea. At least that was where the signs were. But I can see what you mean, I see on the map that it's slightly away from the sea, and it certainly looks passable along the cliffs. The second picture I have given the wrong name, it should be "east" not "west". http://home.c2i.net/laverton/crete/east-of-tripiti.jpg It's this second picture which shows, I am pretty sure, the Klados gorge to the far right. The arrow in the picture is 1-2 hours walk east of the Tripiti gorge. I have some more shots if you need them. Looking forward to seeing something from Stelios. Bernard
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by ity skips this route and pulls out the poles, the path is th |
|
Hi Bernard, I read your comments before I went to Crete and it discouraged me to walk this stretch. In Sougia (18th April 2004) however I heard from some guys who walked it from Agia Roumeli so I decided to try it, with your warnings in mind. I found it passable. I would like to give my impressions about this stretch so that others may know a little of what they can aspect and decide about preparations or about not walking it. For after all, as long as no . I started from Sougia, through the riverbed, and after four hours I arrived at Pikilassos gorge, which is down east of the hilltop Tripiti chapel (also called therefore Tripiti gorge). This part is rather easy and at the end of it you'll find water: just below the top of the Tripiti pass, and also at the end of the gorge in a cistern, opposite a little pink chapel. This water may need some purification. From then on you will find no drinking water untill Agia Roumeli which is still 7 walking hours away, with maybe a night in between. From Pikilassos Gorge to Klados gorge takes about 3 hours and it contains some difficult parts. It starts along the sea, over big stones, but you may manage to remain dry. Then the path slowly rises, along some shepherd buildings. And gradually it feels more safe. Two passages follow which appear a little scary. A first one is a short but narrow path over a relatively young, yellow scree hill. To walk this most safely, push yourself to the hill. Then, a little later, the yellow painted 'End-'sign follows. I believe this has something to do with the marking of the route, it is dated somewhere in 1991. They probably ran out of poles and had to return. At this point I have the impression that you, Bernard, went further down. But in this (very little) gorge you should go up instead, climbing up over some scree that intends to slide down under your feet (climb carefully), pass through a small goat fence (even there), and round the top of the cliff. Then an easy stretch of one and a half hour untill the Klados gorge follows, halfway of which is a nice circle to put up your tent. From the Klados gorge onwards you first follow a long stretch of beach (the highly planted pole at the end of the gorge is a little misleading) and at the end of the beach you climb up again. Signposting is generally clear now. I only missed it at the end, but then Agia Roumeli is in sight and you won't get lost anymore. This part took me 4 hours. Jan Piebe
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
hello. a group of us, nearly fifteen, will soon be venturing to the south coast of crete to take on a section of the E4. as of now we are looking at an east to west approach, starting in imbros through the gorge and heading west to our proposed exit through the agia irini gorge. will we find it more difficult to traverse the roumeli-sougia section coming from the east? also, being that our time period is in march, will it be likely to run into more natural obstacles along the way? any information will be greatly appreciated. thank you for your time. kevin
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
FIRSTLY GET HOLD OF A COPY OF THE 1:25.000 GERMAN ABWHER INTELLIGENCE MAP OF 1943 OR THE 1:50.000 BRITISH MILITARY INTELLIGENCE MAP OF 1941 OR THE RUSSIAN G.R.U.INTELLIGENCE MAP OF 1956. I ALWAYS USE THE GERMAN MAP AS IT IS VERY DETAILED EVEN FROM THAT TIME. THE GREEK SPECIAL FORCES HAVE A MODERN MAP BUT REFUSE TO LET ANYONE COPY IT IN CASE THE TURKS DO TO CRETE WHAT THEY DID TO NORTHERN CYPRUS IN 1974. I HAVE USED THIS MAP AND IT EVEN MARKE WATERHOLES. HOWEVER IF YOU LEAVE FROM AGIA ROUMELI WHERE YOU CAN STOCK UP ON WATER YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO REACH THE TRIPITI GORGE WHERE YOU CAN SPEND THE NIGHT. THERE IS PLENTY OF WATER IN THE CISTERN THERE. THE NEXT WATER FROM AG.ROUMELI IS ON THE LEFT OF THE PATH AS YOU GO DOWN THE SLOPE TO THE BEACH ABOUT 2 - 21/2 HRS ALONG THE WAY. THE NEXT WATER IS AT THE TWO HUTS WHERE THE SHEPHERD LIVES THOUGH HE MIGHT BAULK AT HAVING TO FEED 15! ANYWAY THE TRIPITI IS ONLY A WHILE FURTHER ON. ONCE PAST THE TRIPITI AND UP THE HILL IS AN OLD FORT AND CHAPLE (STILL WELL USED). ONCE PAST THEM THE TRACK GOES STEEPLY DOWNHILL AND AFTER TURNING LEFT THERE IS A GOOD WELL ON THE LEFTB OF THE TRACK. IT IS ONLY ABOUT THREE HRS THEN TO SOUGIA. DON'T UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES BE PUT OFF BY ALL THESE WISHY WASHY WOULD BE WALKERS WHO THINK THIS IS A HARD ROUTE - IT'S A PIECE OF PISS. IF PEOPLE WHINGE ABOUT A BIT OF LONLINESS AND DESOLATION THEY SHOULD STICK TO THE HIGHSTREET OF THEIR LOCAL TOWN!!!! GO ON AND ENJOY IT AND TAKE THE TROUBLE TO REALLY APPRECIATE THE BEAUTY OF THIS TREK . HAVE A GOOD TIME - I SHALL BE DOING IT MYSELF IN SEPTEMBER BUT I SHALL HAVE ALREADY CROSSED THE WILDNESS OF THE LEVKA ORI ON FOOT FROM THERISSO TO AGIA ROUMELI - CLIMBING PACHNES ON THE WAY- AND TURNING RIGHT WHEN I HIT THE SEA AFTER THE SELLOUDA. I HAVE BEEN WALKING ACROSS AND OVER THESE MOUNTAINS FOR THE LAST 25 YEARS AND KNOW EVERY INCH BY HAND SO BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY YOU WILL HAVE A GREAT TIME. ALL THE BEST, ADIO THE CRETAN ENGLISHMAN. JANUARY 27TH '05
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Jürg Reichel |
|
how can I get hold of a map of the 125000 German Abwehr - I plan to do the Trip Sougia-Agia Roumeli at mid October. Would 6 Liters of water be enough for the wohle Trip? Thanks for a aswer Jürg
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Paul Graham |
|
My wife and I did the Agia Roumelli to Sougia walk last Saturday (October 1st), starting out at 06.15 by torch light. We were armed with the Harms Verlag map and Lorraine Wilson's book 'Crete, The White Mountains', but hardly needed to refer to either as we found the route to be very well signed/cairned by Cretan standards. Obviously, you need to re-trace your steps if you see no signs or cairns for more than a minute or so. We are experienced, fit walkers and managed the walk comfortably in just under 10 hours, including a half hour picnic at Klados beach and a 1 hour break at the chapel above the Turkish fort on the West side of the Trpiti gorge (the detour to this chapel is a must for the fantastic views). So, 8.5 hours actual walking time. We set off carrying 11.5 litres of water between us and still had 4 left when we arrived in Sougia at 16.10 (although the sky was overcast for most of the day). This is definitely one of the very best walks on Crete and, for fit walkers in good weather, is certainly not dangerous or particularly difficult. Paul
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
Thankyou everyone for the excellent information about this route. I am always suprised by how many people read these pages, and your first hand information is very useful to many other keen walkers. I would welcome similar feedback on any other walking routes in Crete. At the moment I am working on a project to greatly increase the detail and coverage of maps of Crete through a community project. To this end it would be very useful to have any GPS tracks of walks, or waypoints that have been recorded on the ground in Crete. This will use the google maps API as a framework. You retain the copyright in any data you submit, but permit it to be used free of charge for any site that makes it freely available to the general public. (i.e. it cannot be used in any product that is sold, without your permission). For an idea of how data is overlaid over a basemap, have a look at makemeamap.com If you have a GPS track, simply post it as text data to an appropriate thread on this board. Thanks Peter
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
I have a set of the German maps, and these are excellent - detailed and accurate. I hope to use these as the base for the community map project. The British maps are a waste of time with many errors. Don't bother trying to get hold of them. So far I have not seen the Russian maps, but I would guess they would be based on the German Ones, rather than a separate survey. - If anyone knows where I could see a copy of these please let me know.
|
| AdwareSpy download.AdwareSpy remove adware remove spyware re | Posted by Henry Burder |
|
AdwareSpy gives you the power to detect and remove all types of Adware, Spyware, and other Malware.Adware Spy is an advanced program for adware and spyware removal and protection http//adwarespy.6x.to/
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Gerd Kersten |
|
Last year the path between Loutro and Anopolis has been reconstructed - maybe the same was done between Sougia and Ag. Roumeli. My latest information was that the path had been washed down to the see. Anyhow, be extremely careful, take enough water, and turn in time.
Collecting GPS waypoints along the E4 and other trails is greatly appreciated and would truely help a lot against getting lost. Is there anywhere at least a small collection as starting point? I have recently posted some data to the google earth BBS, cf. http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/postlist.php/Cat/0/Board/EarthTravel and search for "Walking on Crete" or directly klick http://bbs.keyhole.com/ubb/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=EarthTravel&Number=338788&Searchpage=1&Main=338788&Words=Walking+Crete&topic=&Search=true#Post338788 Gerd
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Iain Dawson |
|
I have just returned from Crete (April 2006). I was also told by a local resident in Sougia that the path to Agia Roumeli is not passable at the moment due to landslides. I didn't actually attempt to walk it to find out if this information is correct. Another minor problem is that the start of the path in Sougia is not marked.
A road is being constructed to Agia Roumeli and Hora Sphakion and it will be completed within 2 years. Work has already started. This is obviously going to detract from the challenge and the pleasure of the walk. I also discovered that a GPS is of limited use in Crete without a little guesswork. Neither of the maps I had (Harms Verlag 1100,000 and Road Editions 1100,000) indicate latitude correctly. If you compare these two maps you will notice that the latitude scales are different. This is potentially dangerous. According to my GPS the true latitude for any particular position is between those indicated by these maps so you need to work out a correction factor for whichever map you use. Longitude is not a problem so if you are still on the path at least you can work out where you are. Iain
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter Baylis |
|
I walked this route between Roumeli and Tripiti last year (August 05) and really wonder what all the fuss is about. Technically it is easy enough but arduous and a bit rough in places. It is well E4 marked so no excuse for getting lost. Due to age (73 at the time), I could not make it to Tripiti in one so slept on the trail about 1-2 hours short of Tripiti. Day two I made it easily enough to the beach near (east of) Tripiti.
Here I was tempted to beg a lift from the kind Greek owner of a fast speedboat who was camping with his family on the beach. He took me at breath taking speed to Sougia. In fact I had previously walked the Tripiti to Sougia trail so I did not feel to be missing anything. I cannot see any reason why anyone should not attempt this walk provided they don't mind a bit of occasional scrambling and are prepared for a faily tough walk.
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Luce |
|
My boyfriend and I are just back from Crete and went through pretty much the same experience as Jan Piebe in his 2004 post, i.e. various comments and stories had deterred us from planning this route (the Sougia to Agia Roumeli way), then we met somebody in Sougia who had done it the day before, and decided to attempt it.
We completed it in about 9 hours, with a picnic break. We were carrying about 5 litres of water between us and still had about 1 left when we got to Agia Roumeli - but the temperature never got higher than the mid-twenties. We are middling fit walkers, with no mountaineering experience, and found that the major difficulties were the occasional rock screes - particularly going down the Tripiti gorge - and the last climb after the Klados gorge, which takes an almost straight route from sea-level to a 400+ elevation. As this comes rather late in the walk, we found it by far the most strenuous part. As in "Please-God-let-this-be-the-last-one-for-today" strenuous. Obviously we would have handled this part better if we had prepared this hike. As far as signing goes, we found the numerous cairns on the way to be a welcome supplement to the E4 poles. All we had was the Harms map, but like other posters we hardly used it. Regarding "impassable" parts, I do recall one passage between Tripiti and Klados where the old path had apparently been washed down, and it did take a little climbing quite close to the cliff face. But there were signs to guide us, so that was OK with some careful looking beforehand. The other part that I would suspect to be potentially difficult is the mouth of the Tripiti gorge when there's a bit of sea. All in all I agree with other posters that it is feasible - and definitely worth it - provided you are in good condition, respect the general requirements for hiking in Crete (water, sun protection, mobile phone etc), and do not set out with a constraining schedule such as "must catch the 1700 boat". And for those who are new to the E4, or to walking in Crete, I would strongly suggest to try another hike first, such as the Paleochora-Sougia route, by way of an experience-builder. Also I would not recommend doing it alone, especially for the first time, as we encountered positively no-one for 8 hours on the path. Furthermore, it is our experience that two people are better than one at finding the waymarks -) Hope this helps.
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
Thanks Luce
Your comments are very helpful in keeping everyone planning this walk up to date with the present conditions on this stretch. Peter
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Iain Dawson |
|
As previously posted I was in Crete in late March-early April this year. This was an excellent time of year for walking in Crete ( I went on to do about 250kms over a couple of weeks in excellent weather) but not so good for public transport and accomodation. Sougia was OK as a couple of tavernas and the supermarket as well as a number of rooms places were open, and the bus from Xania runs throughout the year. However a few days later I found all the accomodation and tavernas in Loutro (which is dependent on ferries for access) closed. I talked to a hotel owner there who was busy preparing for the opening of the tourist season and who kindly offered me a coffee. He said only about a dozen people remain in Loutro over winter. For future reference what is the situation in Agia Roumeli when the Samaria Gorge is closed and there are no ferries? Do any of the rent rooms stay open? Can you buy supplies anywhere?
iain
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by De Cock Jurgen |
|
I' m leaving next week for the white mountains and would like to get the map 1 25000 from the GERMAN ABWHER or THE 150.000 BRITISH MILITARY
Can anybody help me? I'm living in Belgium and you can phone me 0032/55425240 or mobilphone 0032495424178 thanks
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter Baylis |
|
Some new Greek maps have appeared that are of excellent quality. They are available online from www.mountains.gr.
Look for the Topo25 series with reference numbers 10.11, 10.12 , 10.13, 11.11, 11.12 and 11.13. Scale 1:25,000. 11.13 covers the E4 walk Roumeli to Sougia and the detail is extremely good. The maps are “GPS Compatible” but the overlay grid, although at first sight, looks like UTM, is in fact the Greek Geodetic Reference System. Regrettably, my Garmin hand helds, (Garmin 12 and etrex VISTA Cx), do not support this. However, there are also black crosses indicating one minute intervals for both latitude and longitude. A home made interpolation ruler with 0.1 minute intervals makes estimation of lat/long at any location easy enough. Having roamed the White Mountains for many years, I have collected quite a few actual GPS lat/long waypoints so I have been able to check the accuracy of some of these maps. I cannot fault them. I think these maps are a must for anyone contemplating walks in the White Mountains. The routes are clearly marked together with useful notes both in Greek and English.
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Polo |
|
Très excité par toute cette discussion sur cette fameuse portion du E4 entre Agia Rouméli et Sougia, je me suis lancé dans l'aventure le 29 septembre 2006. Et me voilà de retour, en chair et en os! Le parcours est assez éprouvant, un peu plus diffcile que les autres sections E4 du littoral sud ouest de la Crète, mais n'en a-t-on pas exagéré la diffculté? Pour moi, la section la plus délicate fut la montée vers le fort tuc depuis la gorge de Tripiti. Beaucoup de cailloux glissants. Quant aux deux passages "impossibles"... pourquoi en avoir fait une telle histoire? N'importe qui est capable de les franchir, d'autant qu'il sagit de très courtes sections, juste quelques pas à assurer. J'avoue même avoir été un peu déçu sur le plan de la diffculté. Mais enfin, je ne regrette rien, c'est un très beau circuit, que je vous recommande vivement. Si vous êtes intéressé par des précisions ou des photos du parcours, n'hésitez pas à me les demander.
Polo
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
Polo
Thanks for your message. Can you give a guide to the time it took to walk each section? I think that is the most useful for anyone else planning the same route. Do give a link if you have placed any of your photos on the web. Peter
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Polo |
|
Dear Peter,
I'll give a guide to the time it took next week. But I don't have a link to store my photos. If you give me your mail adresse, I can send it to you, the best one at first, and more if you like. Polo NB. J'ai lu avec intérêt le récit de Berbad Laverton, et chemin faisant, je me suis demandé où il avait perdu la trace du chemin. (Bernard, je le sais, venait donc de Sougia). Je suppose qu'il s'agit du coin avant le premier promontoire important qu'on rencontre en venant de la plage de Sentoni, après une petite heure de marche. Dans ce coin, il y a une petite ravine, puis un ou deux mètre de passage difficile, cailloux et sable glissants. Enfin j'ai fait une photo de l'endroit, nous verrons bien...
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Paul |
|
My wife and I did the walk from Sougia to Agia Roumelli on 11 October, having done it last year from Agia Roumelli to Sougia. (See earlier entry dated 9 October 05).
Walking times were as follows Sougia to turkish fort on west side of Tripiti Gorge - 2.5 hrs. Fort to shepherd's huts just east of Tripiti Gorge - 45 mins. Huts to mouth of Klados Gorge - 2 hrs. Mouth of Klados Gorge to Agia Roumelli - 3 hrs. Total = 8.25 hrs walking time. This does not include a 1 hr break for a picnic and swim at the fantastic Domata beach (at the mouth of the Klados Gorge) but does include stopping to take about 50 photographs. We found the path to be adequately marked and in a generally decent condition, the only really poor section being a very short stretch between Tripiti and Klados. However, this is not a problem if taken with care. We set off by torchlight at 06.15 to allow us to catch the ferry back to Sougia, but were prepared to stay in Agia Roumelli if necessary. We started with 9 litres of water and used 7, which is about the same as last year. Having done the walk both ways, I would say that the Sougia to Agia Roumelli direction is marginally more tiring, due to the 500m ascent from Domata beach and the descent to Agia Roumelli coming late in the walk, and that the views in front are better in the Agia Roumelli to Sougia direction. However, this is really splitting hairs whichever way you choose, this is still probably the best, most varied wilderness walk in Crete and I look forward to doing it again next year. Regards Paul PS. I would recommend anyone doing this walk for the first time to check out the first half mile or so the day before to save frustrations on the morning of the actual walk.
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Polo |
|
So, I’ll give my walking times
Agia Roumeli to Domata Beach (Klados Gorge) 4 h 30 Domata Beach to Sentoni 3 h Sentoni to Tripiti Gorge 50 m Tripiti Gorge to Turkish fort 1 h 15 (Sleep here) Turkish Fort to Sougia 3 h 30 I’ll also recommand two other routes Koustogerako to Gingilos (Linoseli saddle) 7 h Very nice, but the is one point difficult at the end (loose iron rope above high cliff) Koustogerako to Omalos (high above Irini Gorge) 5 h Difficult to find the last section above Irini Gorge when you come from Koustogerako I also intend to do the mountain path between Gigilos and Sentoni beach (or Agia Roumeli) via Volokias, Kokinavari and Katsaromoura. I saw it on the new and very good Anavasi map (1/25000) But it seems very difficult, and to do it in one day. If two, where could we sleep in the rocky mountain? I’ll be very pleased if somebody could help me, give me informations … Polo
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Jonathan |
|
Peter
I'm interested to know where you got the German 1:25,000 WWII maps from. Was it by chance the British Library? I'm trying to get hold of copies but can't seem to find them (short of trying the BL). Also, the new 1:25,000 maps you mention, do they have contour lines? If so, at what interval are they? Many thanks Jonathan
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
The British Library has the maps as microfilm.
The new maps show contour lines every 20m, but they don't show cliffs. They would not help you navigate or plan a route off paths. The german WW2 maps, by contrast show far more useful detail. I am sorry it is taking so long to get the detailed Crete maps back on line after Google pulled the earlier version of its mapping API. Peter
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Jonathan |
|
Thanks Peter. These look very interesting. One final question though, does the series cover the whole of the island?
Many thanks Jonathan
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Peter |
|
The German WW2 maps cover the whole of Crete.
The new Topo25 Cover Samaria, The White Mountains(2 maps) and Psiloritis. The new Topo100 Cover the whole of Crete in 3 maps.
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Jonathan |
|
Thanks Peter. These look very interesting. One final question though, does the series cover the whole of the island?
Many thanks Jonathan
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Egi |
|
I walked from Soughia to Aj. Roumeli in February 2006, having done this before in 1967 and 1981.
However, what I found positively frightning this time were 2 scree slopes between Tripiti and Klados with 20 ft. drops to rocks below. I had to start off on these slopes without knowing if they would hold my weight or not. Has this been improved on since then ?
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Polo |
|
No, this two scree slopes were not improved. As you can read above, I did this way at the end of septembre 2006.
Polo
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by |
|
Hi Polo,
thanks for reply. But since I am not fluent in French, could you translate into English the relevant part of your report ? Does anyone know whether there is a way round these 2 scree slopes ? Either down by the sea or higher up ? If there is not, I strongly recommend not walking from Roumeli to Sougia but the other direction: Because back to Roumeli takes 5 hours with no water on the way, whereas back to Sougia is only 3 hours passing 2 places with water. Anyway, I intend to do this walk again this April, and will give a full report afterwards. Au revoir Egi
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Polo |
|
Hi, Egi
For a long time, I have been intending to do this route. Everybody told me it was VERY difficult, but when I saw this forum… I to took fright. Anyway, I did it last september. Of course, it is more difficult than the others E4 sections, but it seems to me rather easy after all these words about it. The most difficult section was for me the steep slope up from Tripiti to Pikilasos, with 15 kilos on my back and 8 hours walking under sun. Actually, I think all the route is difficult, with up and down, loose stone, scree slope and pin needles over stones. Il come back to this famous two scree slopes. When you come from Sentoni beach, after about 1 hour walk, there is a first promontory. Inside the corner, after a little ravine, first difficult on this loose slope, there is just place to put the foot ! No other solution to go slowly et carefully. No possible to make his way up or down. Afterwards, you contour the promontory, and come quickly to a little fence door. A another slippery slope, and a another inside corner, with the last slippery passage, with a lot of ground material over your head… To avoid this dangerous corner, it is possible to go down I saw a German who dit it. You said, Egi ,that you “intend to do this walk again this April, and will give a full report afterwards.” Good. But could I ask you something ? I should be very helpful if you can get information - at Agia Roumeli for instance - about the ridge shepherd route between Gingilos and Agia Roumeli, via Papoura peak. I have been told about it, but I have no other information than it is very difficult. I intend to do it in June. Amicalement, Polo
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Egi |
|
Hi Polo,
yes, those are the 2 danger spots ! If you don’t want to carry 18 kilos again, I suggest the following 1. Use the Left Luggage Facility at CHANIA bus station deposit stuff you don’t need on the walk. 2. Buy 3 water bottles -at- 1.5 litres 3. Take the bus to SOUGIA Monday – Friday dep. 13.45 from Chania (Saturday dep. 14.00) Drink one litre on the bus and eat some salt 4. Arrive 15.30 in Sougia. Still four and a half hours of daylight left in June to walk to TRIPITI. 5. Don’t waste time on the way by refilling water bottles at the tiny spring on the saddle before Tripiti because I have always found plenty of water in the cistern at Tripiti 5. Sleep at Tripiti next to the chapel (or inside) 6. Leave Tripiti at 0600. Before, drink lots of water, eat some salt. Don’t waste time over breakfast, use the cool of the morning to get over those 2 danger spots, have breakfast afterwards. Take along 4 litres of water. In June, unless it is cloudy (most unlikely) you will need at least 3 litres to Roumeli, and you should have a reserve in case of accident like a sprained ankle. (In May, I once drank 5 litres). 7. From CHORA SFAKION you can catch a daily bus (dep. 0700) to Chania to collect your stuff deposited there In this way, you can enjoy the beautiful scenery which, after all, is the point of the exercise ! All the best Egi
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by stefano |
|
Dear Peter, do you remenber the Italian guys you met in Katsiveli last year? well, we'll back in a few days (from 19 to 26 of may). We start from palehora and then sougia, roumeli, samarias gorge, kallergi, katsiveli, askifou... Are you on the withe mountains? If no or if I are wrong and you're not the "same" wild Peter, best whishes to you, and thanks for usefull comments I've read on this forum.
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by cross |
|
Hi out there,
can anybody provide scanned copies of the German Abwehrcard and of the new greek cards (may be the one of the army). Pls. send it by email. Which of these describe all possibilities for water intake. Are there any that cover the track from tripiti gorge to the Gingilos saddle (Samaria Gorge). This is an advanced track I would like to walk. Most of the hikers had to abort, since they couldn't find the path and were running out of supplies!! Many thanks, Cross
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Fran |
|
Hi all,
the E4 between between Sougia and Agia Roumeli is a wonderful walk without serious problems for an experienced alpinist. I did it in 2005 (from Sougia to AR) and in 2006 (the opposite direction). The most important point is water; I took six liters with me. More challenging is the Tripiti gorge leading from Tripiti to the Gingilos saddle - does anybody have details about this? Greetings, Fran
|
| Re: E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Polo |
|
For Tripiti gorge, just have a look at this adresse http://www.carto.net/andre.mw/photos/2005/05/03_gorge_tripiti_crete_sud/
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Jonathan |
|
Did this walk a couple of weeks ago (late May 2008). Our day actually started at Omalos and we walked down Samaria, halted in Agia Roumeli and then set off for the Domata Beach at Klados at 4pm where we would camp for the night.
Much has been made of how long this walk should take, some estimates on here saying 8 hours. I think this depends hugely on your circumstances. In the summer and with heavy packs (like us) it takes much longer as you're caught in a vicious circle of your pack weight making you sweat, so you have to make more water, so your pack is heavier and so on. We carried 6 litres each with the target of fresh supplies at Tripiti. Our supplies held - just. Fortunate that we ran into the beekeeper with the donkey who lives by the beach just east of Tripiti. As for the walk itself. It's fine as long as you're on the path - things get rather tricky if you lose the path as we did twice. Starting from behind Roumeli you have a very exposed and slippery traverse across a steeply sloping mountainside of compacted soil, mantled by a thin veneer of loose gravel and a cliff edge a few feet to your left. It's the sort of slope that makes you think that a one big slip could send you over the edge. You just have to ignore the danger and put one firm put in front of another. Fortunately, things improve and a better made path crosses a rockfall before a steep climb up a made but in places broken zig-zag path up a rocky gully through the trees. Emerging over the top you track the coast with the sea far below. The path is mantled in loose stone and dances inbetween spikey shrubbery which bites your legs. A very minor gorge causes no problems but a medium size gorge now separates you from the hills above Klados. At this point you're nearly 600 metres above sea level and are now faced with a rocky descent into this gorge and a climb up the other side. Alhtough navigating from the Loraine Wilson book and the Anavasi 1:25k map, we were led to believe we had to head a distance north into the gorge and then descend. It was at this point we lost the E4. We didn't know whether it was above or below us. We decided to descend through a steep concoction of loose rocks, gravel, solid rock and spikey vegetation into the gorge floor. Not very nice and rather bone-jarring. We then happened upon the E4 path pleasantly emerging from some trees when we reached the gorge floor. Perhaps the E4 descent is rather better than the one we were forced to make! Anyway, another ascent up the other side of the gorge and then a long dscent into Klados. This was the end of a long day for us and the light was fading. The loose marbles mantling the footpath caused a few stumbles for very tired legs. We happened upon the cistern mentioned in the wilson book - the water was poor and not suitable to drink. Then steeply down to the beach at Klados where we just got the tent up before dark. Time to Klados with heavy packs (4 hours) What a fabulous place for an overnight! We were totally on our own, the sounds of the waves breaking on the shore and the sheer peaceful, unspolitness of location made for the highlight of the trip. Next day, an early start (7am) in an attempt to stay out of the sun for as long as possible before it rose above the mountains behind us. We were mindful of scare stories about a badly eroded section between Klados and Tripiti and so marched on, keen to get it over with. We weren't sure what to expect but when we arrived there we were somewhat surprised. Sure, the path is eroded and covered in lose gravel with a steep drop of 20m into the sea, but the gravel is actually quite grippy and it is only a few metres before you reach the safety of a wider ledge and then carefully pick your way behind a large boulder over more loose gravel above a rockfall. As long as you're careful there shouldn't be a problem. Indeed, I actually thought the section out of Agia Roumeli was worse. The next section to Tripiti is fine with no horrors. If you're lucky you'll run into the beekeeper (and his donkey) before Tripiti who has water. A bit of care is needed exiting Tripiti. The Wilson book suggested that the ascent of the gorge side began at a large free standing rock in front of a scree slope. We found such a rock and scree slope (with an E4 sign next to it) and began to ascend. This got steeper and steeper and looser and looser until we were on the edge of what our boots could possibly grip on. The absence of E4 signs was also worrying. After climbing 100 metres above the gorge and getting rather concerned that we were on goat paths with no easy way back down we spotted an E4 sign on the valley floor way up the valley. We knew had to descend, so we traversed (ratherly gingerly) across the scree slope onto a boulder-free section of scree slope then slid down on our backsides to the bottom. So a word of caution to all coming this way - you actually have to travel at least 0.5km up the valley before the actual E4 begins to ascend. There is an E4 pole above a large boulder on the lower part of the scree slope and the zig zag path is obvious. If you see neither of these, you're on the wrong path. After an hour lost on the false ascent we were forced to climb the zig zags in the midday sun which drew heavily on our water. Fortunately, the descent on the other side features a spring with good quality water. After that, the path to Sougia is well made and obvious. The only noteworthyascent thereafter is climbing more zig zags to climb out of a minor gorge, but this is minor compared to the ascent out of Tripiti. All in all, a fabulous wilderness walk which took us 14 hours (including several long breaks) but were pack heavy so slowed considerably. Route-marking is generally good - keep your eyes peeled for E4 poles,cairns and painted rocks and you'll be fine (except in one or two places where you lose them althogether). The issues which can make this difficult are heat, water supply and some steep ascents/descents. I think an early start on a cloudy day in October and travelling light, it could be done in 8-9 hours, now I know the route. Otherwise, enjoy! As Wilson says, the days of these types of walk are numbered - especially given the Cretans massive roadbuilding programme at present (e.g. the upgrade of the Imbros Gorge road to a major highway). So get out there
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Audrey |
|
Hello,
I am REALLY getting mixed messages about the route between Ag Roumeli and Sougia. I have walked the west and south coast, walked several gorges and been up Gingilos and this section in the missing link. I plan to take it easy over 2 days and will be with one other person. If it is too dangerous I plan to walk up the Samaria Gorge, across the Omalos Plain then loop round down the Irini Gorge and finally out at Sougia. Can anyone help?? I will have a full pack on. Thanks. Audrey
|
| Re E4 between Sougia and Agia Roumeli | Posted by Jonathan |
|
Hi Audrey
If you want to quickly get a feel for what the worst of the walk will be like, start from Agia Roumeli. You'll know in the first 10 minutes whether this walk is for you (see my post above). The exposed section many people have referred to above is no worse (arguably better) than the sloping traverse over the loose gravels above the cliffs above Roumeli. Treat it like general mountain walking, i.e. with respect and you'll be fine. I assume you tackled Gingilos from Xyloscala, in which case if you remember the section just through the arch where it is badly eroded/landslip and you have a few metres across a narrow sloping path (big drop to left) covered in small, loose rocks, then if you managed that, you'll be okay on the E4 coastal path (which has a couple of similar sections - see my post above). The rest of the E4 is fine so long as you keep to the path (which generally follows the best lines anyway). Plan your water supplies according to the time of year. I certainly wouldn't do it in high summer when the heat is brutal, but on a cool, autumn day you'd find it very enjoyable and probably very easy. We had full packs and were fine across the 2 short exposed sections. Camp on Klados beach, just wonderful!
|